Sex Advice From Goths

*originally published on Nerve.com, August 7th, 2009. Here is the unedited version.

Jenna, 40

1.) Who would make a better lover and why?–Robert Smith from The Cure, Al Jourgensen from Ministry and Revolting Cocks (or RevCo), Peter Steele from Type O Negative, or Glen Danzig?

….sorry, about 250 “Revolting Cocks” jokes occurred to me and my cerebrum fused. I’m going to choose Robert Smith; any man who can wear more makeup than I do and still look sexy is probably an animal in bed.

2.) Is wearing all black emblematic of a gloomy love life?

When a non-goth girl wants to look really sexy, what does she do? Wears black. We just prefer to look like that all the time. (Velvet, leather, latex, lace, big dark eyes and lush red lips…sexual fantasy or typical goth attire?)

3.) How can I seduce a Goth? And how would a Goth seduce me?

“Goth” covers a lot of ground, from steampunk to fetish, so I’m going to assume you mean the standard-issue “vampire with a side of emo” mainstream image of what a Goth is. They tend to be dark and brooding, focusing on the sensual and mysterious. Get to them through poetry and literature, and wear velvet. A Goth would seduce you by appealing to your sense of the enigmatic and forbidden. There’s a reason that sexy vampires are such an enduring image in pop culture.

4.) The stereotype on Goths is that they have a cynical and/or nihilistic perspective on life and the world. Even if this stereotype, like most stereotypes, isn’t generally true, would a nihilistic perspective—where nothing holds and anything goes–carry over into sex? If not, why not?

Nihilism carries a strong flavor of meaninglessness and ennui. If sex isn’t exciting and life-affirming you’re doing it wrong.

5.) What can we learn from Goth culture about love and sex?

Goth culture esteems mementos mori–reminders that death is always with us. It gives us a deep appreciation for the here and now. Sex is fleeting, so get the most out of it that you can. Love…well, although it’s as impermanent as life itself, look at themes such as those found in Poe: Love unto the grave, and beyond. Goths can be terribly romantic.

6.) Would you date someone who is from the opposite end of the cultural spectrum (i.e. a country-boy/girl or city hipster), and why or why not?

I’d never say never, but there would have to be an extremely compelling reason to date someone whose tastes and views were so radically different. Mind-blowing sex isn’t worth being dragged to an Oak Ridge Boys concert for.

7.) How would you compare the love-lives of the following: a literature-enthusiast, and someone whose daily reading consists of skimming the back of a cereal box whenever they’re bored at the breakfast table?

Goths by nature tend to be introspective, and if you’re going to spend a lot of time inside your own head you should make sure it’s well-furnished. Not reading indicates a lack of imagination, and I’d have to wonder where else imagination might be lacking.

8.) I met someone recently who’s shy but who I’m sexually attracted to. Without scaring her away, when should I stop being friendly and start being flirty?

Don’t flirt at all. Be mysterious and intriguing. Hint at hidden heartbreak in your past. Let her draw you out.

9.) The sexual chemistry between me and my current boyfriend are great, couldn’t be better. But there’s a problem—he can be conversationally inept. The awkward silences can be too much, and it’s starting to bother me. What should I do?

If there are topics that interest him, drop one of those into the conversation as a way to keep him talking. You could also simply stop viewing the silence as awkward; there’s no rule that says you have to be constantly chattering at each other.

10.) My girlfriend always wants to have phone sex whenever we’re apart, but I can’t help thinking how silly it might be. Do I reassure here that it’d be best if we wait until we’re together again, or am I the one being silly here?

How likely is she to secretly put you on speakerphone? Seriously, though: Where men tend to be more visually-oriented, women are beguiled by words. Pick up a book of erotica and read some of the more descriptive passages for ideas, then use the same sort of imagery on the phone with her. She definitely won’t think it’s silly. (Be careful to sound sincere; if you can’t stop laughing it’ll just make her mad.)

11.) How can I have a quickie without being too obvious?

Yell, “Look, a pterodactyl!” then duck into a closet when everyone’s back is turned. (Unless it’s in front of your boss, your parents, or your priest, why do you care if you’re being obvious? See above, about sex being exciting and life-affirming. Seize the moment. It’s good for you.)

12.) My girlfriend LOVES dancing; not only am I bad at it, I HATE it. What can be done?

At the very least you should compromise. If it’s something that she really enjoys, do it once in a while to please her. (This also gives you a bit of leverage when you really want to do something that she hates.) However, the reason you hate it so much may be because you’re bad at it. Consider taking lessons. Your girlfriend will be thrilled that you care enough to do something just for her, which will pay dividends later. (If you want a Gothier answer: Suffer in silence and write poetry about the sacrifices you make for love.)

13.) I recently met someone, and the times we’ve had together were great. But sudden circumstances had cut short what could have been a romance, forcing us to be miles and miles apart. Should I believe that there is still some hope in the end, or should I give up and be content with just being friends?

Goth is ALL ABOUT the unrequited love, but in the real world this kind of thing works best if both parties are in the same emotional boat. If she seems to be similarly willing to keep the spark alive, by all means give romance a try.

14.) A friend of mine keeps confusing me. She talks to me like a close brother, revealing her recent crushes and conquests, but sometimes jokes that she’s really into me. The jokes have been so numerous, however, that I’m starting to get curious. Should I make a move and see what happens, or is it too risky?

Faint heart ne’er won fair maiden, pal. Have a frank talk and explain that her behavior is confusing you. This will give you both a good opportunity to discuss your real feelings for each other, and if she doesn’t mean to be leading you on it should stop her from sending mixed signals.

15.) I’m very choosy when it comes to potential serious relationships. That being said, I feel lonely sometimes. Should I stop being so choosy and finally branch out, or is it best to be this way?

Depends on your definition of “choosy.” Do you mean that if a potential partner doesn’t meet every single one of your “perfect mate” criteria, you reject them? Definitely branch out and perhaps take a strong dose of Reality. View a potential partner in terms of things that you’re willing to compromise on (leaves socks on the floor) and things that you aren’t (puts babies on spikes). If you simply can’t compromise any further without being miserable, learn to embrace the solitude until the right one comes along. There’s no need to feel lonely between relationships: Take up a new hobby, join a club, or do something else that allows you to interact with others.

Gino, 23

1.) Who would make a better lover and why?—Robert Smith from The Cure, Al Jourgensen from Ministry and Revolting Cocks (or RevCo), Peter Steele from Type O Negative, or Glen Danzig?


lol, if I had to choose probably Robert Smith. Seems like he would be more sensitive about it and really laid back. Plus it seems like he could play the part of the girl more easily than I could. Also, it seems like he has soft skin.

2.) Is wearing all black emblematic of a gloomy love life?

It's not actually embematic, but more so accepting that the darker things in life don't always have to be sad or depressing. The mysteries of the dark and never knowing what you might find make it all the more intriguing. There can be a lot of beauty in the dark if you can see it just right.

3.) How can I seduce a Goth? And how would a Goth seduce me?

First you get a black rose, and tie it around your neck. Then you get dirt from a grave and smear it heavily over your clothes for that nice musty smell. Haha, really it's just like talking to other people. Just because we dress differently or think different means we are a different species. Your best bet is just try and have a regular conversation, see if you got anything in common, and go from there. Just don't be surprised if the person you are seducing has a bit of a "bite" in them.

4.) The stereotype on Goths is that they have a cynical and/or nihilistic perspective on life and the world. Even if this stereotype, like most stereotypes, isn’t generally true, would a nihilistic perspective—where nothing holds and anything goes--carry over into sex? If not, why not?

Eek, thats just a loaded question. In general for the Goth culture we are just generally more accepting that the world is a shitty place. There is no sugar coating, just the plain facts about it. At the same time we can see that there are some redeeming qualities that certain people can have. As for it carrying over into sex, I could see someone with nihilistic tendencies have a preference for rougher sex. Perhaps they would indulge more with BDSM with a few other fetishes. Then again I've known some nihilistic people with absolutely no sex drive whatsoever.

5.) What can we learn from Goth culture about love and sex?

Learn to experiment and see what you really like. Goths tend to be more open to new ideas and experiences, so when something comes along and catches our eyes we are usually inclined to try it out. When it comes to love, well that is a very deep emotion that you shouldn't have to hide.
Express it with the person you love, and don't be afraid to keep it hidden in the shadows.

6.) Would you date someone who is from the opposite end of the cultural spectrum (i.e. a country-boy/girl or city hipster), and why or why not?

I've actually dated most people from every spectrum, including a country girl and a ghetto girl. My reasons were that I saw aspects in them that I was really attracted to and vice versa. Just because I wore all black didn't mean we couldn't have fun together. As a goth you experience the situation of being judged and biased against in some cases. Eventually it gets to the point where you look beyond the superficial to what a person really is on the inside.

7.) How would you compare the love-lives of the following: a literature-enthusiast, and someone whose daily reading consists of skimming the back of a cereal box whenever they’re bored at the breakfast table?

I'd say that the literature enthusiast would have at some point read up on interesting sexual methods and positions to make their lives more interesting. As for box boy, I'm seeing a lot of disapointments in his future and possibly a broken condom.

8.) I met someone recently who’s shy but who I’m sexually attracted to. Without scaring her away, when should I stop being friendly and start being flirty?

Try out by testing her comfort level when it comes to sex. See if she has had any experience or how willing she is to open up about it. When she fully opens up, you have a chance. Other than that you could try to see if she has a very loose friend.

9.) The sexual chemistry between me and my current boyfriend are great, couldn’t be better. But there’s a problem—he can be conversationally inept. The awkward silences can be too much, and it’s starting to bother me. What should I do?

It's probably a matter of trying to find something in common, or bring up a subject that greatly interests him. It usually comes down to finding a common ground, even if you have to do a bit of research to find what really gets him talking. Or you could have a verbal affair with a stranger in a coffee shop.

10.) My girlfriend always wants to have phone sex whenever we’re apart, but I can’t help thinking how silly it might be. Do I reassure here that it’d be best if we wait until we’re together again, or am I the one being silly here?

Of course you're the one being silly. As long as your not in the middle of the mall on speakerphone while having phone sex, there is nothing wrong with it. Just remember that
it's probably a better idea to speak in a slow sensual voice, and go over every detail as it goes through your mind. Otherwise you might remind her that your actual sex life is rather dull and routine.

11.) How can I have a quickie without being too obvious?

Camaflogue works wonders if you don't want to be noticed. Also it helps if she doesn't wake up.

12.) My girlfriend LOVES dancing; not only am I bad at it, I HATE it. What can be done?

Thankfully there are different types of dancing and different music. Do a bit of research and go on google. Find a style that suits your style of music, and ask her to take lessons with you. It's a great way to get rid of that extra left foot, show her your outgoing, and you can make some new friends in the process. Besides, you don't want to see her dancing rather exotically with another guy in a club while you are on the sidlines do you? Do you?!

13.) I recently met someone, and the times we’ve had together were great. But sudden circumstances had cut short what could have been a romance, forcing us to be miles and
miles apart. Should I believe that there is still some hope in the end, or should I give up and be content with just being friends?

If you think there is a chance that something can happen, then try to plan more events where just the two of you can be alone and spend some quality time, but make it fun. Go to a zoo or aquarium, or challenge her to either bowling or pool. When the moment is right and you are both laughing, having fun, then bring up the idea of actually dating. But be careful, otherwise you might make a mistake and drive yourselves farther apart.

14.) A friend of mine keeps confusing me. She talks to me like a close brother, revealing her recent crushes and conquests, but sometimes jokes that she’s really into me. The jokes have been so numerous, however, that I’m starting to get curious. Should I make a move and see what happens, or is it too risky?

Have you ever talked to her about your crushes and conquests? If so and she ever seems kinda jealous, then maybe so. Otherwise if she is too calm about it, then it might just be the close friend deal. Or you could just try asking her.

15.) I’m very choosy when it comes to potential serious relationships. That being said, I feel lonely sometimes. Should I stop being so choosy and finally branch out, or is it best to be this way?

Like I said before, as a goth you learn to branch out and look beyond yourself. If you limit yourself to such a narrow field then you greatly reduce your chances. Besides, trying something differently might help you learn more about yourself and help you get out more.

Alex Rose, 24

1.) Who would make a better lover and why?—Robert Smith from The Cure, Al Jourgensen from Ministry and Revolting Cocks (or RevCo), Peter Steele from Type O Negative, or Glen Danzig?

Omigah Peter Steele all the way. Have you seen his nude photos?!?

2.) Is wearing all black emblematic of a gloomy love life?

That couldn’t be further from the truth! Goths are actually very happy people! Our frowns are just upside down smiles, and the black we wear on the outside just shadows thrown by our inner sunshine! Why would anyone think different?

3.) How can I seduce a Goth? And how would a Goth seduce me?

Come across as someone vampiric, i.e. a night owl who looks like they experienced death but is alive again only to sink their teeth into some warm flesh by moonlight. The Goth would usually do the same. The lust for lifeblood, and the marriage between life and death, light and dark, is what Goths and vampires are all about. Except that vampires would die from light, and Goths don’t really care for it. So don’t take what I just said literally, of course. Just take it for granted that it makes sense somehow.

4.) The stereotype on Goths is that they have a cynical and/or nihilistic perspective on life and the world. Even if this stereotype, like most stereotypes, isn’t generally true, would a nihilistic perspective—where nothing holds and anything goes--carry over into sex? If not, why not?

It sure does. I mean, I’ll try most anything once. I know some other fellow Goths who are the same way, because to us, sex is an honest act; a lot of its power is taken away if there are strict rules to abide by, and what are rules if they aren’t in some way things we wouldn’t follow otherwise, because it wouldn’t be true to us? There are, however, other Goths I know who are actually quite reserved and don’t do much. I’d like to think of them as former suburbanites who graduated from the Hot Topic School of Alternative Lifestyles. They don’t like this, of course, because it’s the truth.

5.) What can we learn from Goth culture about love and sex?

We can learn that love and sex aren’t all rainbows and sunshine like the movies would have you believe. Sometimes it’s dark, and it’s better this way. Makes love and sex more diverse and unpredictable, which is the stuff of life…and better movies.

6.) Would you date someone who is from the opposite end of the cultural spectrum (i.e. a country-boy/girl or city hipster), and why or why not?

No. Never. I stick to my own kind. Goths know what’s up. I feel like the rest are just catching up, but when it comes to sex, who really wants to wait?

7.) How would you compare the love-lives of the following: a literature-enthusiast, and someone whose daily reading consists of skimming the back of a cereal box whenever they’re bored at the breakfast table?

Reading tendencies shouldn’t matter, but rather how they read their own bodies in relation to others. I know that sounds kind of corny, but that’s what I think. Who knows? Maybe Cereal Box Reader only has time to read cereal boxes from all the love he’s making, while the literature professor can only speak of the sex he’s read in books.

8.) I met someone recently who’s shy but who I’m sexually attracted to. Without scaring her away, when should I stop being friendly and start being flirty?

It depends; some shy people are closeted freaks who need someone to pry open the door and lure them out. In this case, be flirty as long enough and as delicate enough (read: not terribly aggressive) to earn her sexual trust. Both of you should gradually but surely win in the end. But if she’s shy to the point of paralysis, you may as well forget about it. No amount of tappable ass is worth all the unrewarded effort.

9.) The sexual chemistry between me and my current boyfriend are great, couldn’t be better. But there’s a problem—he can be conversationally inept. The awkward silences can be too much, and it’s starting to bother me. What should I do?

Maybe you can make up some sort of script that you guys can follow whenever the conversation starts to lag. Adopt certain personas and role play to get the two of you acting together outside the bedroom for once. Otherwise, forget him. Like I said, no amount of tappable ass is worth all the unrewarded effort.

10.) My girlfriend always wants to have phone sex whenever we’re apart, but I can’t help thinking how silly it might be. Do I reassure her that it’d be best if we wait until we’re together again, or am I the one being silly here?

If you’re not comfortable with it, don’t do it. ‘Cause if you do, then the likely result is incredibly awkward sex, and that’s pretty bad for both parties. Convince her you’re worth the wait; the anticipation might add to the deed later.

11.) How can I have a quickie without being too obvious?

I think it’s almost impossible to not come off as obvious in any way; it’s inevitable to flash a bedroom eye here or there, and to have the word ‘sex’ underline such petty requests like “Wanna hang out?” or “Wanna drive me home?” There is an art to seduction, but that may take some time. If you want a quickie, drop the art so you can get to dropping some pants; a quickie’s a quickie, after all.

12.) My girlfriend LOVES dancing; not only am I bad at it, I HATE it. What can be done?

Let her do her thing on the dance floor while you’re away, sparing yourself, and her, the potential embarrassment. I assume you hate dancing because you were never good at it, could never get the steps and timing right. If she’s the type to run away immediately with someone just because he knew how to dance well, then she wasn’t serious about you to begin with. She may be grinding on other guys with clothes on, but at least she’s doing the same to you with clothes off.

13.) I recently met someone, and the times we’ve had together were great. But sudden circumstances had cut short what could have been a romance, forcing us to be miles and miles apart. Should I believe that there is still some hope in the end, or should I give up and be content with just being friends?

Ever heard of skype sex? Never could people be so far away from one another and yet be so close to each other! Something like this might inspire a physical reunion to happen sooner.

14.) A friend of mine keeps confusing me. She talks to me like a close brother, revealing her recent crushes and conquests, but sometimes jokes that she’s really into me. The jokes have been so numerous, however, that I’m starting to get curious. Should I make a move and see what happens, or is it too risky?

Make a move. This could be the love of your life! Sometimes, the jokes we say are the lighthearted and passive versions of what’s true to us. So make a move, and if it doesn’t work, well, play it off as if it were a joke.

15.) I’m very choosy when it comes to potential serious relationships. That being said, I feel lonely sometimes. Should I stop being so choosy and finally branch out, or is it best to be this way?

Yeah, you should probably, like, chill out and take whoever may come your way. Everyone’s more or less the same anyhow.